Now that I’m inspired by your views on the misinformation, disinformation, countering that, how we should work more closely together on that front, I think that’s one very good element. Also, the trust , as you described the…The people feel that it’s not the government that it’s fact-checking, but it’s government empowering them to fact-check themselves.
If you go to a pharmacy, you swipe your NHI card. You get nine mask. After a few minutes, you can refresh the browser and see the stock deplete by nine. Of course, we add to it a online ordering component, but the core principle is the same. It is trusting citizens with open data because we are a republic of citizens or 民國.
Our radical transparency serve as antidote because people know the context, the why of policy-making, why we are talking about this, why we’re not doing this, why we are doing this. We share the bad news and we share the good news. If we only say the good news like in a propaganda, people don’t trust us, and they shouldn’t.
When we say when the environmental activists set up their own air measurements, we can’t beat them, we must join them, I’m not saying something that is philosophically controversial. I’m saying a fact in Taiwan. If there’s a disaster and the local government publish a number and Tzu-Chi publish a number, people are going to trust Tzu-Chi number.
Of course, the national high-speed computing center would never do such a thing, but it is people’s right to distrust the government, and it’s the government’s duty to find ways to trust the people. We innovated and find a few people who are very well-versed in this new technology called distributed ledger technology, or DLT, commonly known as blockchain.
During the Sunflower, because the g0v was this hub of all the Occupiers’ information, it’s not just the reach, which is easily in the million. How many million I don’t know, but the public trust on the information here is higher than the government’s own news source. We need to work with them [laughs] to be seen as accurate. There’s...
This is a mutual trust -building on both sides of the civil and government sides. I think that that’s gradually crowd sourced and formed during the later part of 2016. I was also working as an understudy already at that time with Minister Jaclyn Tsai, that’s since December 2014 to January 2016. That’s also for a year and a few months.
After being asked of doing the impossible, the g0v community just dispersed into all the different corners. Because of the Occupy, there’s this implicit trust between the 20 or so NGOs and the g0v people who supported to get their message across. We were not seen as random strangers. We were the comrades in some sense, who worked just a couple months ago.
What I mean is that we start small, like 5,000‑people level, and gradually build that trust , instead of just having the most controversial, the most difficult. I wouldn’t say that if we do a, for example, same‑sex marriage forum we would get meaningful results. We would need to get people’s habit into this kind of process for this situation.
Should I use the Portuguese slides? I gave workshops and distributed three versions of the talk. Just a second... [switched to French slides] Very, very briefly. So g0v is three groups of people who didn’t necessarily talk to each other. There are two chapters in your book that talk about this: sometimes the NGO moves too slow, because they don’t trust strangers.
Most of my work — the things we just discussed — was during Trump 1.0. Not my first rodeo. Even then, we worked closely with Keith Krach, then under secretary of state, to popularize the Clean Network — now often framed as trusted technology — so supply chains (TSMC and others) source from vendors that do not cede control in exchange for state subsidies from CCP‑aligned entities.
Working with TSMC and Friends, we published an international standard, SEMI E187, applied zero trust principle in manufacturing, especially around semiconductives. That actually rolled out even before we fully secure our government’s Class A, meaning holding the national person data, competent authorities, all the ministries, 47-ish, is already rolling out ZTA for government competent authorities, that’s slated for end of this year.
Exactly, and if a local community just tries very hard to adapt to that, it opens up itself to even more interactive defects, cons, scams, and so on, because there is no local knowledge to counter that. If I’m operating a language that I don’t actually know, I don’t have those trust signals and that will exacerbate polarization and precision persuasion thing.
What we did instead was digital competence in education, so that all of our children and also elders become participating journalists in fact-checking. And that’s how we survived that particular AI disruption to the fabric of trust . But now with targeted spearphishing and interactive deepfakes, we need to do something like that, upskilling for the civic journalists, again, and on a coordinated scale.
We do know that that secure and trusted interoperability enhances your overall security most often. How do you balance all of the different objectives including public policy making? Taiwan’s very good at thinking about this. We’d certainly like to continue to stay engaged and aware of where you’re at, and… what you’re thinking about. How we evolve our business here accordingly.…
We have had to think about two-factor authentication and secure by design. If I go through the three different parts, in terms of the rules of the road first. Let me give you and example on cross border data flows, how can you do those securely? How can you do enable data flows that are privacy compliant, consistent ways to have trusted data flows?
This is what’s called a PET, a privacy enhancing technology specifically oblivious federated story or whatever. Using these designs, you don’t have to put blind trust in any particular data controller. Instead through design you can ensure that the service still gets accomplished, but there’s nothing that a telecom doesn’t already know about you ends up being revealed to the operator.
As you shared, I think the investment of funding, of loans and investment is one, but as I describe here, our investment here is about making it easier to conduct business. Instead of signing papers and FedEx-ing those papers, we should be doing e-signatures, and so on, making the services easier, lowering the transaction costs, increasing the mutual trust , this is my purview.
If companies want to participate in governance, and also building of trusts through, that dialogue is very important. On the other hand, since I am working at the financial institution, I feel that there is a certain hurdle or obstacle to horizontal dialogue between the government and business because the relation between the two is, in a sense, one between the supervisor and the supervised.
Certainly. Back when I was dropping out from the middle-high school when I was 15, my principal, head of my school, agreed only because she understand that the kind of research I want to do about building trust over the Internet and so on cannot be studied in the schools or in the universities at the time. It was such a very new field.
