Thank you very much. You, too. Thank you too, very much. Bye. Have a nice day.

Fantastic.

Fantastic.

If you’re interested, then this can become more collaboration-oriented. On the production of academic work, as well, we are very open on that.

OK, fantastic. Thank you very much for using some of the time where you have no day job to share with us.

There are days in which I’m quite free. When we come back, so is the week from the 20th to the 24th, or after the 24th? Sorry.

That’s fantastic. I will look at my teaching schedule, because there are some days in which I cannot have a call at 10 o’clock in the morning.

I think it will be very convenient to schedule a call. We’ll look at the material if it’s fine with you. We’ll come back to you, and then we’ll see when we have a time where it’s easy to work together.

I will start thinking, and plan time for me. From the 20s, I think we will both be in London.

I’m sorry, you’re right.

That, I think, will help also you to better understand what is possible to be done, and maybe the best spaces to move forward.

Thank you very much. [laughs] Maybe what we can do is during the break, in the breaks, we look at the documents that you have shared. Then if it’s possible, if you have time, you know, maybe mid-January to have another call, so that we can be also more structured ...

Can I call you Audrey and you can call me Antonio, and…?

That is very helpful. That will be excellent. That will be another very interesting part to look at how it is enforced and what is the outcome of this process. This is extremely valuable. Thank you very much.

It’s because the reason is the value element we want to assess and we want to understand what are the impacts of these innovation on different values, and then be able to take the informed decision.

Then we have to look at how different technological configurations are impacting upon values. I think this is very interesting of the approach of the sandbox. That is not, “I give you freedom to do whatever you want just for the sake of it.”

Especially, if I may say, that is exactly the core of my research on the digitization of the public sector is on the value issue. Technology is a fundamental part, but this is also what I’m doing in all of the executive training to government, etc., is the values.

I think the final product can be copied, but the process that leads to the final product, I think, is unique. That is where the elements that then are leading to these profound institutions transformation are shaped.

What I think we are looking at this as possible opportunity is the understanding of the process by which you got there. I think that is the most interesting to be looked at from a research perspective. It’s not the final product.

Exactly. If there’s something that, to me, is extremely personal. That is it’s not the sandbox, per se, but it’s the negotiation that is behind it. Obviously, the sandbox, you can study it, but it’s a lot of information.

Francesco?

I think the idea of this call is – and first and foremost, thank you very much for accepting it – is to see if there are areas where we have common interests, and if you are interested in maybe the work that we do, and to see if it ...

Out of that – especially with Francesco, and that is, I would say, one of my main research interests as well – is to see how the digitization of public sector activities is negotiating with the legal system. That is why we’re the sandbox initiative, which has caught our attention.

I’m saying in a positive sense.

Not always, I think, a great digital innovation in the government is very interesting for academics. What makes, I think, interesting for us is what is happening in Taiwan is actually the way in which you are thinking, framing, and allow me to say, experimenting.

Looking at what is happening in your country, it has been, clearly, very interesting for us. Not only how much is happening, but the way it happens. There are countries that are digitizing a lot, because it’s just the context is very favorable. There’s been transformation of country. Things have ...

We are extremely interested in looking at, learning, and studying in novelty approaches to e-government, and the digitalization of public service, and I would say to every kind of transformation in the public realm that is mitigated by technology for it and outside technology.

I think it’s been one of the first formal e-government courses taught in masters program in our university. I’ve been engaging in projects and in relationship with, I would say, governments around the world.

I’ve been at the LSE for 20 years now. I’ve established what is called the e-government course here again this year, and I’ve been teaching it for, now, 12-14 years, something like that.

If you want, I can give you a little background, and…

Thank you very much for accepting this call.

Good morning. Oh, sorry. Good afternoon.